tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post1220523299544644289..comments2024-02-29T09:58:18.342+01:00Comments on The Swiss Ramble: Juventus - Black Night, White LightThe Swiss Ramblerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11423088862174893998noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-38241215204536484002012-03-01T11:04:01.953+01:002012-03-01T11:04:01.953+01:00So, would you recommend to invest in Juventus, and...So, would you recommend to invest in Juventus, and which key points do you consider to be vital if the share price should rise/fall - maybe even dramatically?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-68126534057592584972012-02-14T09:46:32.388+01:002012-02-14T09:46:32.388+01:00The old old team of Juventus, lets hope they won`t...The old old team of Juventus, lets hope they won`t ever come to 2nd league again, Juventus FOR THE WIN <a href="http://seohelp.co.il/%D7%9E%D7%90%D7%9E%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9D_%D7%A7%D7%99%D7%93%D7%95%D7%9D_%D7%90%D7%AA%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9D/19" title="עיצוב אתרים - הצבעים" alt="עיצוב אתרים - הצבעים" rel="nofollow">עיצוב</a>.avizazhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05354595322631332306noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-25254616464579887522012-02-10T07:15:47.537+01:002012-02-10T07:15:47.537+01:00Really a huge piece about my favourite team financ...Really a huge piece about my favourite team finances!<br />I've just discovered the blog, and I think that I'll really need time to explore it!<br />Thank you man!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-18958259493133281212012-02-02T01:17:42.569+01:002012-02-02T01:17:42.569+01:00COOL BLOGCOOL BLOGTravel expert Shamimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14477418730093096377noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-78215367580010899192012-01-30T02:24:29.881+01:002012-01-30T02:24:29.881+01:00like thislike thisherohttp://www.herowintolo.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-74183618430710127572012-01-14T22:16:47.724+01:002012-01-14T22:16:47.724+01:00Very good articole about the Old Lady. Juventus ha...Very good articole about the Old Lady. Juventus has a great potential in Match Day and Commercial incoming. The new stadium is a great resource (a capacity of 50000 places would be ideal). The games are sold out, it is open seven days a week, the commercial area is a great investment, the Juve Store generates a lot of money and enthusiasm, the museum is coming soon (spring 2012) and the stadium tours are booked well. All this investments are of course connected to regular participation in Champions League (and Italy has only three available places for a few years). TV incomings are always high in Italy because of the presence of SKY and Mediaset. In Italy, you can never reach the level of Commercial like Germany, England and Spain but Juventus is now on track. Participation in CL will improve the situation and increase revenue.<br /><br />On the pitch, Antonio Conte is doing a great, I would say unbelievable job. He is a legend as player. His accuracy is spectacular and unique. Maybe not at the level of Lippi and Capello, but certainly better of Ancelotti, Deschamps, Ranieri, Ferrara, Zaccheroni and Delneri (Corradini has played only 2 games). Juve is going to dismiss Grosso, Motta, Krasic, Toni, Iaquinta and Amauri so they can economize a lot of money in player wages. The purchases of Barzagli, Lichtsteiner, Pepe, Pirlo, Vidal, Giaccherini, Estigarribia, Vucinic, Quagliarella, Borriello and Matri have reinforced the team on pitch. Sorensen and Marrone are great talents. This season they must play only in Championship and Italian Cup. The situations sustains the rebuilding of the whole staff. The participation in CL will increase the attractiveness of the club (which I think is already high). I am confident and the future is bright. This season is crucial, no doubt about it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-41928945793973025792012-01-14T14:23:28.106+01:002012-01-14T14:23:28.106+01:00Hello great article.
Without doubt Serie A was t...Hello great article. <br /><br />Without doubt Serie A was the best league in the world and all of a sudden all the clubs were found to be debt-laden and the league fell from grace. <br /><br />Could you do an article on whether serie A can return to such highs. <br /><br />& if there are lessons the EPL should learn before it too becomes a victim of over strecthing itself. <br /><br />Thanks, keep up the good work.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-17346637633440067592012-01-14T01:01:54.713+01:002012-01-14T01:01:54.713+01:00I disagree with you sir. Trading players though go...I disagree with you sir. Trading players though got a high profit margin but it shouldn't and cannot be the main activity of a self funded institution like the club.<br /><br />Why did the report neglect some news like the speculation of a huge lawsuit to claim for compensations for the falsely alleged calciopoli? Also, is 67 million mentioned as rights to name the new arena a really good deal ? I highly doubt that but nevertheless, this report is a work of art, thanks a million...as a Juventus fan, Business Student and future shareholder of the club, I thank you ))<br /><br />Mohammed Shaaban, EgyptPirlohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10329098054320361683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-17211233874872126112012-01-13T20:14:52.609+01:002012-01-13T20:14:52.609+01:00Re: Sapienza
Prior 2006 whole Italy is in false ac...Re: Sapienza<br />Prior 2006 whole Italy is in false accounting or doping administration. Juventus isn't really gain that much. The fastest way to boost current balance sheet was increased the cost in the future to allocate backward. How to do that? Through flopped cash plus player deal. Buffon is good but he worth 40M? Or that cash plus player deal at that time worth 40M? (cash plus player including Jonathan Bachini, 10M rated)<br /><br />Also for Inzaghi, Sold for more than 30M Euro, but 10M for them was Zenoni's card (Zenoni himself was swap for Gianni Comandini, Luigi Sala Luca Saudati along with Donati) How much Juve got to sell Zenoni?almost nothing.<br /><br />Also for Matteo Brighi. Once a wonderboy and traded half to Parma for 5M, as part of 7M Di Vaio loan.<br />A year later sold to Roma for 16M!! (as part of Emerson deal) Why Roma accept 16M price tag because Roma also owe something to Parma during flopped Nakata deal (yet another multi-player exchange but in turn Parma forced to released the bargaining chip for low price, as they were flopped) At that time Emerson had only 1 year left in his contract and a near 20M selling profit is very good.<br /><br />Italian know very well in amortization and recently the doping administration is back, and Inter, Milan, Bologna Chievo, Parma, Cesena seems involved by selling youth players for youth players with high price, again.neohongkonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03249166507347511171noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-18717989501369488622012-01-12T13:52:07.779+01:002012-01-12T13:52:07.779+01:00You mention that German clubs show greater commerc...You mention that German clubs show greater commercial nous than their Italian counterparts. Can you recommend any good articles on German clubs being smart commercially? I'd be interested in reading up on them.emmethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06960773219905693783noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-22019809350398362512012-01-12T02:40:51.631+01:002012-01-12T02:40:51.631+01:00If Amauri, Iaquinta and Toni move this January, Ju...If Amauri, Iaquinta and Toni move this January, Juve will have more than enough wage room for next season. Not to mention players like Grosso, Motta and possibly even Krasic, who are lucky to make the bench, nevermind get playing time. <br /><br />I expect the wage level to stay the same next season, or possibly be a little lower, as the wages of the above players was high despite their roles as backups, and with exception of a lb, I see the majority of the signings for next season being for depth.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-26513032206340878682012-01-11T00:49:44.184+01:002012-01-11T00:49:44.184+01:00The 7.5% stake that is frozen, If the new regime i...The 7.5% stake that is frozen, If the new regime in Libya decide to sell their stake, it will be interesting to see who replaces them, or if Exor expand their stake further.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-25545846258770397872012-01-10T22:54:08.977+01:002012-01-10T22:54:08.977+01:00As far as I understand a big issue re. stadia in I...As far as I understand a big issue re. stadia in Italy is that local councils have not wanted to sell grounds to clubs because of the revenue it brings, hence the need for some kind of legal motion. Without purchasing the grounds it will be difficult for clubs to secure borrowing to develop a new sight, unless the ownership shoulder the liabilities (think this is happening with Roma). However, with the need of public bodies to reduce debt levels and sell of assets under the Monti government there may be a window of opportunity here as councils decide to cash for the short-term.<br /><br />On Juve, I've heard that stadium was designed to be expandable quite easily? Is this true? I imagine that club will be looking at matchday revenues of above €50m in the not-to-distant future, raking up prices and/or expanding capacity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-32062769694707704262012-01-10T18:06:55.433+01:002012-01-10T18:06:55.433+01:00Hello I am an italian Juventus big fan. In 2004-...Hello I am an italian Juventus big fan. In 2004-2006, the Deloitte Money League to Juventus was in the top three, had revenues equal of Barcelona, Real Madrid and Manchester United. By the property Exor Agnelli heirs family of Juventus, in addition to the reasons for the demotion, there was certainly a bad management. The fact Juventus in the last five years has the trend of revenues more 'negative in Europe. Juventus would not have problems to have occurred as a new property 'like Manchester City, Paris St. Germain, and the heirs Exor Agnelli Juventus have ruined, and that' a common thought of many fans. It 's a big scandal having made only a 40 000 seater stadium just because property doesnt wanted to invest more. Juventus will be forced to expand over the next 5 years and still do not know how, surely we will need a new property.Prior to 2006, Juventus had a management leader in Europe, but the problem of property after the death of Umberto Agnelli was always there.Luca Sapienzanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-67799103692648203992012-01-10T00:37:11.576+01:002012-01-10T00:37:11.576+01:00They did well to secure a big chunk of the financi...They did well to secure a big chunk of the financing for the stadium. Should provide a good template for other Italian clubs. <br /><br />Just goes to show you how much politics is involved in stadium development in Italy when Juve, the club fresh out of serie b, can build a new stadium but the rest cannot go beyond paper designs.<br /><br />Many of the projects in the pipeline still involve city funding, so it hardly solves the long term issue of Italian clubs owning their grounds.<br /><br />Looks like Juve will maintain this advantage for a while.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-12748940071384386352012-01-07T19:49:23.954+01:002012-01-07T19:49:23.954+01:00The more intimate ground will do them well in the ...The more intimate ground will do them well in the long run. As shown in Germany, sponsors gravitate towards packed stadiums, rather than larger ones which in Juve's case, would only be packed for 4-5 games a season.<br /><br />Given how well their commercial income has held up despite the difficulties since 2006, the double whammy of consistent CL qualification and a broadcast friendly stadium mean there is considerable scope for improvement in that field. There fanbase is large so the 2 factors mentioned earlier will make the task that much easier.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-54978945620652703612012-01-07T13:34:59.250+01:002012-01-07T13:34:59.250+01:00Hey, could you make your tables bigger, or just wh...Hey, could you make your tables bigger, or just when you click, they could gain size? Because it's hard to read it on the phone, thanks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-39404331331356351202012-01-07T00:55:09.881+01:002012-01-07T00:55:09.881+01:00Juventus purchased the adjacent land surrounding t...Juventus purchased the adjacent land surrounding the stadium. The continassa area seems to be a project of significant scope based on the size of the land. They only paid 1m euro for the land as the area was run down, but with completion of the stadium, I imagine it is already worth more.<br /><br />The club plan to devolop the area, and I'm sure this will open up other revenue streams. Last I read, a hotel was on the cards, as well as a new club headquarters. <br /><br />CL football is important for Juve's finances as far as remaining competitive is concerned, but in terms of Exor being able to cash in on Juventus, the above will surely help their cause regardless of on the field success. In any case, this is highly unlikely as the Agnelli family have strong ties with Juventus, especially with Andrea now running the club (although John Elkann is certainly the one who pulls the strings courtesy of his position at FIAT and Exor.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-62015847748612998922012-01-06T09:00:34.115+01:002012-01-06T09:00:34.115+01:00@Mikaels1985,
Tax can obviously have an impact in...@Mikaels1985,<br /><br />Tax can obviously have an impact in attracting the best players, so it is possible that clubs would have to raise their gross salaries, so that the net amount is the same. This was a problem for English clubs a couple of years ago. How big a factor is difficult to say.The Swiss Ramblerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11423088862174893998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-78409217713785286022012-01-06T08:57:20.150+01:002012-01-06T08:57:20.150+01:00@sportgamma,
A couple of interesting articles the...@sportgamma,<br /><br />A couple of interesting articles there - thanks for the links.<br /><br />It certainly has not been a profitable investment to date, looking at how the share price has fallen, both since the original flotation and the last capital increase, but there is an argument that the business model now (with the new stadium) could deliver.<br /><br />As your article says, Juve's cash generation is not too bad for a football club. That said, from a purely financial perspective, there are better investments out there. Money can be made from investing in a football club, but this is usually only if the current owners sell to another investor and I'm not sure that is likely in the case of Juventus.The Swiss Ramblerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11423088862174893998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-6548160694883123122012-01-06T08:52:06.737+01:002012-01-06T08:52:06.737+01:00@Anonymous (2:39),
It's possible, though I th...@Anonymous (2:39),<br /><br />It's possible, though I think my estimate of €30m is reasonable, especially as the last time Juve were in the CL, they received €21.5m in prize & participation money. Taking your points in turn:<br /><br />a. As I stated in the article, this could go either way, so I've deliberately been conservative here. Juventus have a well-established brand (for want of a better word), so it could be argued that the BetClic deal was not affected by lack of CL qualification. In fact, there are clauses included in that deal, whereby the amount varies depending on participation in Europe.<br /><br />b. Essentially, you're right, though the 2010/11 revenue allocation on which I based my assumptions was already based on only 3 Italian teams in the group stages, as Sampdoria were eliminated in the qualifiers.<br /><br />c. Yes, there should also be higher gate receipts, though the 2010/11 results already include money for Europa League matches, so the impact will not be that high. If you look at the variance analysis in the annual report compared to 2009/10 (when there was CL), there is hardly any difference for this factor. That said, the new stadium will deliver more revenue per match - but I already included that in my estimate for New Stadium.<br /><br />The key point, of course, is that CL qualification is hugely important for Juve's finances. As you say, this would benefit many areas.The Swiss Ramblerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11423088862174893998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-18706800648990734792012-01-06T02:39:56.074+01:002012-01-06T02:39:56.074+01:00If Juve reach the CL, the impact will be exacerbat...If Juve reach the CL, the impact will be exacerbated by a few key factors, imo. <br /><br />- You mention in your article that their shirt sponsorship deal is in its final year, so CL qualification will certainly put them in a stronger negotiating position for a new deal. More so if they remain in their current league position come june.<br /><br />- As there will only be 3 Italian representatives in next seasons CL, am I right in assuming the tv market pool money distributed by UEFA will be larger for Italian clubs as a result of it only being split 3 ways? Or will the total amount allocated to Italian teams be smaller, therefore negating the benefit of the money being split the 3 teams instead of 4? According to your article, serie a has the 2nd largest tv rights deal in Europe, and I believe this factors into uefa's formula when distributing the money, IIRC.<br /><br />- More matches played as a result of CL, and therefore higher gate receipts. Also, given Juventus have missed out on CL competition 4 times since 2006, they will be seeded lower, meaning they will meet some strong teams in the group stage, and I fully expect the club to charge more for these games, as the demand will be higher.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-45224733704669291372012-01-05T23:13:18.564+01:002012-01-05T23:13:18.564+01:00Thank you for a very informative article. Especial...Thank you for a very informative article. Especially your thoughts on the future earnings profile. <br /><br />Whats your take on the Exor and the Agnelli´s? Is it a question of throwing good money after bad, loyalty to the family pet project or do they expect this to be a profitable investment. If you look at Exor, they seem to be fairly good capital allocators.<br /><br />http://sportgamma.net/2011/03/12/juve-reevaluating-the-original-thesis/<br /><br />http://sportgamma.net/2010/10/17/market-value-of-juventus-shares/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-39443355565299972382012-01-05T23:04:51.628+01:002012-01-05T23:04:51.628+01:00Amortization, that may be more. There is saving on...Amortization, that may be more. There is saving on temp. player but the figure almost equal to the increase of amortization as the loan cost was some kind of installments. For example Matri 2.5M and 15.5M/4years<br /><br />Additionally Juve signed five additional signing (Vidal, the Swiss, Montenegrin the Dutch? and Giaccherini) with the saving of Amauri, Tiago in amortize (both just moved to write-off) and due to the sale of Sissoko, Amortization may be rise to 12 million or even more, as late August signing actually amortized 2 months to 1 day for last day buy instead of 3 months for players such as Motta.<br /><br />It just only partially counter-weigh by the possible sale of Melo. And looking back to the squad i don't think Juve had more valueable player/youth product which generate profit by exceeding its un-amortize value (Recently i was counting how many goalkeepers Serie A clubs stacking, for example Manfredini, Matteo Trini to big name such as Rubinho, all mid-table club practice balanced-budget or even surplus budget, Juve was hardly profit within Serie A but from foreign and Milanese) Lastly Borriello had a wage bill of 5.4 million in gross and Roma give him a leaving incentive may be for wage cut, but it only possibly count-weight by Amauri finally want to leaveneohongkonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03249166507347511171noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-487486960623783530.post-24848635173417033222012-01-05T16:02:00.700+01:002012-01-05T16:02:00.700+01:00Extremely interesting and spectacularly exhaustive...Extremely interesting and spectacularly exhaustive read, SwissRambler. Many thanks for that!<br /><br />Your projected FFP analysis gives good hope for the club's financial future, though it all inevitably rests on that Champions League qualification, doesn't it. Missing out on it another year would be disastrous.Marco P.http://juventiknows.com/noreply@blogger.com